Feb 23, 2022
Sophie Shiloh
You're listening to the codependent millennial podcast with Sophie
Shiloh episode 49 Omisade Burney-Scott on being sweet to your damn
self
Hello, my love. So nice to be talking to you so happier here right now. Today's episode is a treasure. It's a conversation I had with a woman named Omisade Burney-Scott. I want to read to you the words that she uses on her website to self identify. But I think powerful introductions are about so much more than someone's bio resume or a list of all their most notable accomplishments and she has many. But I think it's really important when introducing someone to emphasize the impact they've had on your life. And so that's what I want to do here in this intro as well because while I've only known that Omisade exists for like, two weeks, she really has had an incredibly profound impact on my life. I learned about Omisade and her multimedia project called the Black Girls Guide to surviving menopause a few weeks ago on YouTube, I was watching those amazing style like you interviews and one really stood out there was this radiant, gorgeous woman on the thumbnail. She just looked electric. She was radiating. And then I saw the title. It said my body was screaming at me how depression saved Omisade Burney-Scott's life. And that's my story. So immediately, I was just like, Okay, this is a human that I need to learn from immediately. It was such a moving interview, but I was left with so many questions. So I went to her website started devouring podcast episodes, started seeing all of the incredible things that Omisade is doing out in the world and I was just overwhelmed and inspired and enlightened by her work. So go to the shownotes to find everything that she has going on because there's a lot and it's all really good. She has a zine called messages from the menopausal multiverse. She has an amazing podcast called The Black Girls Guide to surviving menopause. She has essays on grief and love and liberation and so much more. Her website is Black Girls Guide to surviving menopause calm. Her podcast is Black Girls Guide to surviving menopause and you can find her on Instagram at oceans sweet and sour, sweet and sour ocean sweet and sour. I'm seriously so honored that these women that I admire and appreciate and call on as guides want to talk to me. My intention with that statement isn't to belittle myself at all. But after the conversation with John on the last episode and this conversation with Omisade and with a couple of other things that I have in the works like I'm just blown away, really by this huge web of a community that you don't even realize exists before you dip your toe in. Please don't wait a single moment or talk yourself out of it when you feel the spark of wanting to get in touch with someone even if your brain tries to tell you that they're too important and smart and busy and powerful and cool to talk to you. I just recorded interviews with two of my heroes in the span of 30 days so you can literally do anything. Trust me. Trust me. Before I roll this interview with her I'll read to you her own words about who she is and what she does. Omisade Burney-Scott is a black southern Seventh Generation native North Carolinian feminist mother and healer with decades of experience in nonprofit leadership, philanthropy and social justice. She's a founding tribe member of spirit house, and previously served as a board member of the beautiful project village of wisdom and working films. Omisade is the creator of the Black Girls Guide to surviving menopause, a multimedia project seeking to curate and share the stories and realities of black women and femmes over 50. She's a graduate of UNC Chapel Hill, the proud mother of two sons and resides in Durham. Now, without making you wait another moment, please enjoy this conversation that I had with Omisade. Omisade Burney-Scott, you are amazing. I want you to give a little bit of an introduction. I'm going to introduce you of course before this, but I want you to tell my audience who you are what is really important that people know about you.
Omisade
That's a great question. And thank you for having me. So I think
the things that are really important to me, that I want your
listeners to know is not what I do, but who I am and who I'm trying
to be. So who I am. I am a seventh generation North Carolinian so
I'm southern who I am As I'm A I, my parents daughter, and my
parents or ancestors have been deceased now for almost 20 years or
more. So, I move in the world as somebody whose child but not
somebody who's here physically anymore. I am a sister. I have older
siblings and a younger sister. I'm mom to two spectacularly
beautiful black boys, who aren't boys anymore. My oldest son will
be 30 next month, my youngest son will be 14 in October. But they
they've taught me so much about like, how to love and how to love
myself and be more soft and open and gentle with them and with me.
I am an Aries. Me Sue. Yeah, but with a Leo moon and Leo rising. So
I am fire fire in fire.
Sophie Shiloh
Incredible. That's so powerful.
Omisade
I think that's important for folks to know.
Sophie Shiloh
Yeah, exactly what they're getting into,
Omisade
you know, just just be prepared. And I'm a really passionate person
around healing. My own healing, and the healing and safety of my
people, black people. Healing of our country, healing of our
culture is my my thing. I think that liberation and radical love,
like is at the core of healing. So that's really important to me.
And like who I'm trying to be, it's just a really happy, vibrant,
safe, joyous, young person. That's who I'm I'm trying to be?
Sophie Shiloh
Can I ask you to elaborate a little bit about radical love and what
that means to you how you embody that how you use that in your
relationship with you?
Omisade
Yeah, so I think, you know, I had a very traditional kind of view
of what love is, I have older parents, who were both born during
the Great Depression, and raised in Jim Crow South. And so a lot of
the ways that I experienced love from my parents was, you know,
providing you something, right, like you have a home, you have a
safe place to live, you have a safe place to lay your head, you you
are going to school, you'll get to go to college. You're safe, like
your physical safety, in terms of like stability was like a really
important thing. But kind of emotional vulnerability was not
something that was always available to them. And I understand why.
And I also feel like for me, I didn't think that I could be as
sensitive as I am emotionally, I felt like that was problematic. So
I started to try to figure out like how to mask my emotions or mask
my sensitivity, not very successfully, honestly. And so as I've
gotten older, and also have been on a pretty consistent journey
around my mental health and my wellness, radical love looks like me
actually allowing myself to be much more curious and open to my
authentic self. Like, who is she? What does she want? What does she
desire? What does softness look like? What does intimacy and
vulnerability look like? In all relationships, I choose to do have
access to that, because I don't think that everybody should have
access to it. I think boundaries are really important. But I think
that the radical part of it is like, what does it mean for me to be
vulnerable to myself, and allow myself to have whatever kind of
thoughts I might have? And be curious about the origins of those
thoughts without shaming or being embarrassed? Or if I am feeling
some embarrassment for a thought or if I am feeling some shame or
whatever, for thought to allow that to just be released from me in
his time, you know, and not like you're failing you have to hurry
up and get over this thought, like no, I'm not feeling I'm like
this thought has is here for a reason or this feeling is here for a
reason. And so I think the radical part of that is like, working
everyday to suspend judgment working everyday to sit to alleviate
shame, working every day to be more open to who I am in who I
allowed to have access to my authentic self. So.
Sophie Shiloh
So that is a beautiful lead into just me saying just for a second
about how I discovered you, because I found out about you five
minutes ago, essentially. And I really, I saw your style, like you
interview and I was immediate. I'm like, I'm done, like, so I'm
done. It's, I was blown away. And so I haven't had the chance yet
to like, listen to quite every single podcast you have. But I just
dove in immediately and started gobbling them up. So the the thing
you said the phrase you said, that kind of hit me and just told me
that I had to reach out to you and talk to you and learn everything
you have to say. And all of that was you talking about just being
sweet to your damn self. And part of that, you know, includes not
coming to yourself with judgment and shame, like you just
mentioned, which is amazing. I want you to talk more about that.
But that there are so many ways for us to be sweet to our damn
selves. And you also had an interview with blue now, who was that
interview? Everyone has? That's just, it's prerequisite information
for like, a woman on earth. You know what I mean?
Omisade
I think so too. She was a absolute hoot when we interviewed when he
was in her night dress, like she was actually like, anybody gonna
see this? I was like, no, no, I'm in my pajamas. As it's fine. I'm
in blue. Now it's fine.
Sophie Shiloh
For her to just show up so much as her that she didn't even check
before. Like, that's just so powerful. And so. So this concept of
being sweet to your damn self, talk a little bit about that,
because coming out of, you know, a childhood, where you're
describing you were shown certain kinds of love, and you were
probably not shown how to love yourself in other various important
ways. So like, what is what does it mean to you to be sweet to your
damn self? Now? How do you do that? How have you learned that over
the course of you know, having kids experiencing menopause? This
simple question should only take, you know, one or two sentences to
answer. It's no big deal.
Omisade
Maybe maybe 12 or 13. But um, so I want to say something, you know,
I my parents worked really, really hard, really hard. And my, my
mom was super lovey. And like a huge cheerleader of anything that
my younger sister and I wanted to do in terms of like,
extracurricular activities, if we wanted to do dance, if we wanted
to, whatever she was like, yes, let's do it. Let's make it happen.
And I think that was born out of her not having access to so many
things as a kid, like they were really, really, really poor. The
thing that I didn't see my mother do was take good care of herself.
She was always extending that out to other people. Are you good?
Are you hungry? Are you cold? Are you sleepy? Let me take you here.
Let me take you there. I didn't see my mom rest until my mom gets
sick. And that that felt like a really, really important part of my
framing of like, what does it look like to take care of yourself?
What does it look like to be sweet to yourself? What does What does
rest with this care look like? She just did not read. And she
wasn't the only one that I observed doing that inside of our
family? Like, none of the black women inside of my family? Didn't
know. Yeah, that they were always in
Sophie Shiloh
the concept was just like, foreign entirely. You know,
Omisade
the concept is foreign. Because it's not a luxury that black women
are afforded in many ways. It's definitely that generation. Right?
Like I said, my parents were not boomers. My parents were the
greatest for
Sophie Shiloh
Yeah, so that was not even a question.
Omisade
Absolutely. What do you do you work hard? Yeah. And you take care
of your family. And you're in constant motion, you're cooking,
you're taking someone to this class or someone to this club,
there's always something going on. And so my relationship with rest
to me is like an exemplar of a place where I wasn't I didn't know
how to be sweet to myself, like rest to me is such a really
important part of my sweetness practice now. And I think that what
are the unintended outcomes of the pandemic, is that it allowed me
to lean in more deeply into the fact that I don't know I don't know
how to rest. I still struggle sometimes even working remotely even
still working primarily from home Like carving out times in my day,
where I'm just in a place of just rest and ease, and not in motion.
Even inside my house, you know, I teased that, you know, the
virtual world that we kind of operated now I feel like I'm in a
long hallway and I'm running from one Zoom Room to the next, you
know, Oh, are we on Zoom? Are we on Google me? Are we on Google
meet? Are we on Skype, and I'm just running around in this virtual
space. And like, giving myself an opportunity to stop in this
virtual space and go outside and get to stop and to lay down even
if I'm not taking a nap. Like if I don't close my eyes to go to
sleep, but just to, to recline. Yeah, and let my body soften and be
quiet and just settle in. I listened to music all the time anyway.
But to put on some music that just lets me just like time travel or
relax? Yes, time travel. Yeah, all the time, all the time, whatever
it may be. So the being sweet to myself, right now primarily looks
like the ways in which I allow myself to rest. And I think it's
still a journey of figuring out these things, and unlearning a lot
of what I saw growing up as a kid. Yeah.
Sophie Shiloh
So unlearning. Let's pause there for a minute, the undoing you
mentioned that in your interview with Dr. Jenn from decolonizing
therapy, you talk about the undoing of so much of what we were
taught, the disguises that we put on ourselves in order to survive
and the, you know, just the various habits of either not resting or
telling yourself that you're not allowed to not giving yourself
permission to do all of this. Like, I think it relates also to
sovereignty, having sovereignty over your own body in your own
life. Literally just living it as if it is yours because it is it
is so tell. Tell talk a little bit more about what you have to undo
what you have to unlearn in order to be a happy woman. Yeah, you
know what I mean? Like, that's really the essence of it.
Omisade
I mean, you know, I want everybody to be happy people, however,
right? Cis, hetero woman, whoever's listening to your podcast may
not identify that way. Exactly. Everyone who listens to you to know
that what hat for me, the undoing or the unlearning? Absolutely
kind of exists inside of these constructs that we live in, in this
country. Right? So capitalism tells you gotta be like producing,
producing, producing, producing, I'm a genetics kid, right? So it's
like, Where is the evidence that you are a valuable person? In? Did
you go to college? Where did you go to college? You know, there's
always the bar of like evidence of your legitimacy. Or if you're
fraudulent, like, it feels like it's like one of those kind of like
Whack a Mole situations like you can never actually get it right.
So it's like, okay, inside of a capitalistic construct, what does
success look like? You got to go to college, you got to go to a
particular kind of college. You got to have a particular kind of
degree or a particular kind of job, but you got not just have any
job. What's your title in your job? What do you do? What are you
responsible for? Are you a supervisor, like how many people use
provides? Do you have a budget? Well, how big is your budget? Like
it's always like,
Sophie Shiloh
proof and also the competition of how much do you overwork this
masochistic competition?
Omisade
masochistic competition of like, I literally put in 65 hours, I'm
killing myself. Yeah. Right. And if you being like, Oh, my God, I
put in 80 hours last week, and then they're like, but I'm getting
to go to Cabo. So I feel so much better about it. So it's like,
Well, why do you have to do that? Yeah, like, it's very bizarre way
in which we're in the hyper productivity, hyper, you know, hyper
speed of work, like you have to prove your worth. Yeah. And I you
know, and because I operate with an intersectional identity of
someone who is a black who's black, who's a woman who sits who's
heteros college educated, who I feel like has been pretty
successful and being able to take care of myself most of my adult
life, not all of my adult life. Most of it, yeah, you know, you you
move in a way where you're like, you also realize how much white
supremacy and patriarchy is like jacked you up.
Sophie Shiloh
Yeah. And that hits you and then you're like,
Omisade
Alright, and so the unlearning is why am I doing this? Yeah. Am I
actually really happy don't want to do this. Well, if I stopped
doing this what what will I lose? Am I'm willing to lose whatever
that is? Like cuz some But what I think I will lose is like,
actually not real anyway. So like, how do I give myself permission?
To be very clear, I've never worked in corporate America. I've
always worked. I worked in higher ed. And I've worked. I've worked
in social justice in the nonprofit sector. And so in the US think,
Oh, well, that doesn't happen inside of the social justice
nonprofit. That's not true.
Sophie Shiloh
Yeah. Oh, god. No, I mean, ya know,
Omisade
the hyper hyper work that exists inside of nonprofits is to me
again, an example of like, how capitalism and white supremacy work
ethic, like, what have you working seven days a week? Every Dragon,
I
Sophie Shiloh
come from that world to it,
Omisade
and I'm talking to you, so drag, my oldest kid is to drag him to
every single meeting every single action, every single protest
every single phone game, you know, every single board meeting, you
know, he, for the longest time, che was always the only kid in the
room. Yeah. You know, and, you know, there was some, you know, I
don't know, honor in being like, oh, yeah, right.
Sophie Shiloh
Yeah. Which I mean, it honestly, that does make sense. Because
like, fuck, yes, you're raising this incredible aware child who's
engaged and who sees the impact of how he and how his mom walks in
the world. But then there's like, what you what you're saddling
yourself with, when you allow yourself to live only in that way.
There's, there's no rest, there's no connection with hand, there's,
like,
Omisade
no rest, and there's no there's no boundary, right? There's no
boundary, there's no like, somebody could call me at nine o'clock
or 10 o'clock at night. And when, especially with Che, because my
boys are 16 years apart. Yeah. So Jay, you know, focus, disrupt
whatever time that I should have been really dedicated to being in
mommy mode with him. Yeah. And be like, Listen, I need to talk to
you about this, or I'm working on X, Y, and Z. And, you know, he
just learned to go with the flow with it and be like, you know,
snuggle up underneath me while I'm working, um, or, you know, take
care of himself and be in his room. And you know, both my boys are
very, Loki, chill, chill as kids. So I'm very blessed in that way.
But I also know that the way that I sometimes showed up for him, I
won't do that with Taj. I've changed with Taj. And I think that,
and che sees that we've talked about it, too. We've talked about
that, as he's an adult, and what that was like for him. And, you
know, talk about that with ties, you know, and I'm very clear with
people who are working with me now, like, I'm, I'm not available to
talk to you after a certain time. Yep. And I will not allow that
time to take away from ties. Yeah, it's very important to me now,
I'm, I'm divorced. I've been divorced now, for nine years. And so
it's really important to be in a healthy co parenting relationship
with his dad. And it's really important to be in a healthy
relationship with both my boys as I'm still parenting an adult
child and a teenager. Yeah. And so those boundaries became even
more clear to me with my depression around really needing to take
care of myself and really needing to be at home and comfortable
with my kids and math and my family and allowing them to take care
of me and be be open to that.
Sophie Shiloh
Yeah. So one of the most challenging things for women to do, I
think, just based on observational and, and personal experiences,
receiving love, receiving care, not only from ourselves, but from
others as well. So, how have you been able to really sort of
surrender to that and say, No, I'm not going to be a martyr
anymore. I'm not going to, you know, base all my worth on how much
I'm willing to sacrifice anymore. I'm not going to play this
masochistic competition game of how much can I suffer? How much can
I work? How much can I sacrifice? Um, you know, talk a little bit
about your experience of just saying no, I'm, I'm going to allow
myself to exist and exist beautifully and exist with joy.
Omisade
Hmm. Well, the first thing is I don't have any illusions of
perfection. What's that quote? that perfection is the thief of joy.
Yeah, so I don't know. Sophie. I'm still figuring that shit. Yeah.
Like I legit. Don't know. Like, fully. Like, I'm just I know what I
do know is I'm committed. Yeah, I know that. It's a practice for
me. And so I know that every day I'm like, I wantOmisade to be
happy. I want Omisade to be whole. I want Omisade to be safe. I
want Omisade to be creative. I want Omisade to be committed. But I,
every day, I am trying to disrupt any illusions of perfection. And
some days I feel really good at it some days I suck the entire.
Yeah, some weeks, I sucked the entire week where I'm just like, oh,
this was just like, pushing a boulder up a hill all week long
around all of my imposter syndrome, all of my ways in which
fraudulent even at almost 55 years old. Yeah. All the ways where I
feel like I'm still in my own little anxious attachment style,
dancing as hard as I possibly can to get people to be like, aren't
you just the sweetest little lovable thing, right? And then that
doesn't happen and be like, dance faster, dance harder, be more
shiny, you know? And then maybe someone will be like, Oh my God,
did you see this person over here, just dancing, and sweating
profusely? Let's give them all the love that they need. Let's
protect them. Let's Let's offer them resource. So they can feel
really, really good about themselves. And so I don't have a
perfection. I don't have a way that I will say to someone. This is
this is the life hack. Here, look, here's the plot twist. Sophie,
there is no life hack. Yeah, there is no life hack. I think the
life hack is if you decided that the way you've been moving in the
world is detrimental to your spirit, to your soul, to your
happiness to your heart to your mind. And you just got to figure
out ways to cut that shit out. Just cut just figure out everyday,
how am I gonna disrupt this? What's a real simple thing I can do to
disrupt this today? How can I disrupt tomorrow and just be in a
constant place of oh, if something pops up, and I realized that I'm
dancing again. I'm dancing really hard. And you're like, What are
you doing? Oh, are you tired? Are you? Um, does this feel like a
familiar scenario? You feel like you're time traveling right now
back to Yeah.
Sophie Shiloh
Like where'd you go? What happened? urge you go,
Omisade
come back, come back, come back. You can actually breathe. Take a
moment. Like I need a moment. Let me hit you. All right back. Take
a break. Take a walk, take a nap, drink some water. chill out for a
second. And then decide what you need. Like yesterday, I was on a
call with some folks that I work with. I trust so much. I've trust
them, respect them. I love them so much. And I was feeling really
crispy and tired. And so I asked for support, which is not
something I would have done. Previously, I would have likely just
been sitting on the zoom with pinched eyes. Mm hmm. Oh, and like,
headache brewing behind my eyes. And they would say, Oh, me, so are
you cool to do that? I'm like, sure. Yeah, no problem. I'll get
something to y'all tomorrow. And yesterday, I was like, Y'all, I
cannot I need someone else on this team of people who I believe in
and trust and nor fully capable to take this piece for the next
couple of weeks. I can't do it. I have too much on my plate. And I
will not only will I not do it. Well, I'll be resentful if I have
to do it. And they were like, nice. Thank you for being honest and
asking, of course, we can take that for you. And I was like,
thanks. I really appreciate that.
Sophie Shiloh
so valuable. That honesty, that self awareness to self knowledge.
Yeah. And I just want to also honor how and thank you for doing
that. Because when when women who younger women like me look up to
do that. It really does. I know, blah, blah, blah permission is
something you can only give yourself, you know, whatever but but
it's also not, you know, it is really really valuable and helpful
for us to see. strong, capable, confident, beautiful women or
genuinely people of any gender identity, none of this matters, you
know, etc. But seeing you do that knowing that you have that
experience of doubting yourself in that moment saying no, I really
should over extend. No, I really do want to bend myself until I
break here but you don't. And that gives us permission not to as
well. It's just I just want to thank you. It's really powerful.
Omisade
It is so important. Yeah, love is it is so important and I think
that we often see people in front was we see them doing it, we can
we can see bear witness to folk engaging in the back bend in the
breaking in the hype speed in the hyper productivity. And we also
we watch, we are bystanders, yeah, in order for there to be
reciprocity in this healing in this unlearning, where we actually
extend ourselves to the folks that we care about in the book that
we're working with are being created with and say, Listen, I'm
noticing that you've been really doing a lot of work. Are you
taking care of yourself? Is there something I can take off your
plate, you know, and it's really ironic I, you modeling that will
transform how you show up in the world, and also the next
generation. Case in point. A couple of weeks ago, I was working, I
had a really, really long day, working with a client with my
consulting practice. And I had been in my little office space all
day long. And Taj came home from school, and I was still here and I
said, Listen, I'm just going to be a long evening, so I'm going to
actually just ordered some food and he was like, no problem. Then
he came back upstairs. He said, Is there anything that I can do for
you? And I was like, um I don't know. He said, Is there anything
around the house that you need done that I could just take care of
for you? And I was like, what the kitchen cuz you some support. He
was like, considerate that. He's 13. Oh, like, Consider it done. So
this kid goes downstairs. Oh, me. It should. Anyway, that's his
job. But we got there, cleaned the kitchen, took the trash out.
Just and then I ordered the food. He unpackaged the food put on a
play. It gave me some sugar. And was like, wow, I was like, I love
you too sweet. And that that's a big deal for me. Because this this
kid was like, I know she's got some stuff. She's She's committed to
I had a deadline and I couldn't like yeah, wiggle out of that.
Yeah. So he was like, was there anything I can do to take something
off? You're
Sophie Shiloh
like, we're on the same team. Mom, you're going to pull an all
nighter? What can I do? Yeah, I got you. Yeah.
Omisade
I think is important for us to extend that kind of care to the folk
who are in our lives. Yes. We're doing work with to be able to say
to someone, look, Sophie, I see you're working really hard.
Sweetie. Is there something I can take off your plate? As opposed
to just watching you burn? Yeah, we watch each other burn all the
time as as women we watch each other burn. We like who she is just,
she's gonna crash and burn. Don't stand there and observe
Sophie Shiloh
dad there. Yeah. witness to that and then be like something. I knew
you were gonna crash
Omisade
and burn. I was I was concerned. Were you really not
Sophie Shiloh
helpful? Were you really? Yes.
Omisade
Really? Like, that's a big Aflac.
Sophie Shiloh
I didn't hear from you.
Omisade
I was like, stretched out to you like I was concerned. But I
figured if you was doing it, you knew what you were doing.
Sophie Shiloh
Like, I told you to reach out if you needed anything like,
yeah.
Omisade
Which is another thing that we do when we see somebody in kind of
in a grief cycle. Yes, exhibiting their their post traumatic stress
are their trauma responses. And so we just watch,
Sophie Shiloh
don't wait for them to ask for help. Yeah, you cannot do that. And
you know, it's so trendy for people now to talk about being trauma
informed. You can't be trauma informed. If you talk about relying
on this hyper individualistic method of healing. It's just Yeah, I
know that we could just rant on that forever. Really
Omisade
good. You really could I think that, you know, some of the ways in
which I feel like people are talking about trauma informed work, or
trauma informed activism, sometimes feels very passive where you're
watching someone and you're like, oh, what I'm observing right now
is their trauma. So I'm just gonna have their trauma, as opposed
to, oh, what I'm observing right now, is this person operating in
their trauma? And that can activate me to speak to this person and
say, I'm observing some things. I'm curious about some things. Are
you open to us having a conversation about it? And also, this is
what I'd like to offer you. Are you open to that? Like it's always
to me like, I don't just want you to be curious and observing the
from a kind of like an anthropological study.
Sophie Shiloh
Yes. A voyeuristic kind of No,
Omisade
no, I want you to actually be engaged and invested. So I know I
can't expect that from every thought, everybody. I'm not gullible
enough to think that that's available to everybody. But the people
who actually say that they are down for me, and I'm down for them,
I would prefer if they see me operating from a place of my trauma
to be like, Oh, me, I have noticed. Yeah, last couple of months or
the last couple of weeks, XYZ. You want? Can we talk about that? Do
you feel open to talking about this with me? And is there something
I can do for you? This is what I'd like to offer. And I'm always
that person. When I'm talking to folks that I work with, or that
I'm in relationship with us? I will. What do you need? Do you need
me to listen? Do you? Would you like me to reflect when I'm
hearing? Yeah. And can I offer you something? Yeah. So you know,
I'll say, Would you like to take a walk this weekend? I'd love to
walk with you? Or would you like to have some tea? We'll have tea
outside? Or do you feel comfortable having tea inside? And want me
to send you a playlist? You know, I think I'm a DJ Sophie, I'm the
you know, people. I'm a curator of vibes.
Sophie Shiloh
I was gonna ask you for your music earlier. And I was like, I don't
know if she'd give me her personal Spotify, but I'm gonna need
Omisade
it and I will send you my Spotify. Curator of vibes and I will say
to someone you want me to make your playlist?
Sophie Shiloh
Um, that's, that's like a special kind of love.
Omisade
That's deep. That's like a 21st century mixtape? Are you kidding
me? That's,
Sophie Shiloh
that's intensely special. If someone does that for you,
Omisade
if somebody thinks enough of me to curate a playlist for me, I
think we go together. I think you want to say yeah, like, do you
want to do that?
Sophie Shiloh
Yeah. Are you like, what's going on here? What do you what kind of
messages are you sending? Yes, but this, this is huge. You also
talk about music like that. That is, okay. So when you ask someone,
how do you want me to support you right now? How can I show up for
you? So many times, we don't know how to ask, we don't know what to
say we don't know, like, especially if you're at the very
beginning, like clients, when I first start working with someone,
oftentimes, they don't know what they like to eat. They don't know
what kind of music they like, they've lost themselves, they've
abandoned themselves for so many years. They just they don't know.
But for you to say, hey, here are some of the ways that I like to,
to connect to nature to my self, that I like to ground. Let me
let's do some, like that's extremely helpful for people who just
have gone so far off the path of self love that they do not know
how to care for themselves. They need like, let me show you how to
do this. Let me like, yeah, it's a, you need Wayshowers I
think,
Omisade
though, you need Wayshowers. And you need wayfinding tools like to
get back on your path. You know, and it's sometimes you're, when
you're off your path, it can feel really scary and isolating it to
have someone look at you and say, I'll go with you. Yeah. And
you're like, you will be like, Yeah, sure. I'll go, let's go, let's
go.
Sophie Shiloh
Let's go, this path is one that you can walk, it's not going to
kill you. It's gonna, it's gonna be the best thing that ever
happened to you this actually. Okay, let me ask you this question.
Because that reminds me so much of the language that I use for this
question be being afraid of something and it actually working out
beautifully. So, um, oh, okay. So what do you wish you could tell
your pre menopausal self yourself in your 20s or 30s or 40s?
yourself during your most confused or uncomfortable? So like, when
you were on your path, and you were the most confused or the most
discouraged, the most lost from yourself? What do you think helped
bring you back? What were your wayfinding tools? What helped you
bring or come back to yourself? Does that question make sense?
Omisade
It does. Yeah, I have I, you know, I'm having this visualization
right now of, you know, times, especially in my 20s and 30s. My,
you know, my parents passed away in my early 30s. And I felt very
much like wow, like, how am I moving in the world now, without
parents like, this is such a hard thing. I still have so many
questions and so many things I want to know and I'm, and I'm
grateful that I actually developed it and started practicing
African traditional religion that allowed me to develop a really
deep relationship with my ancestors. And so, one of the things if I
could time travel back to myself in my early 30s, I would say you
can slow down, slow down for a second. I have a seat at the seat.
Here, drink some cool water. Take a couple of breaths. I'm holding
your stomach and let your stomach just before. Just relax, soften
your belly, soften your jaw, relax, your ancestors are all around
you, your parents are all around you. They might not be here with
you physically, but you can still talk to them, you can still have
a deeply loving relationship, you can still heal with them. And
you're going to get to know them better. Now that they're not
physically here, you're going to be surprised by some of the things
you learned about them in the next 20 years. And it's true, there
have been things that have been revealed to me, inside of our
family about my parents, in particular about my mother that I
didn't know, until, like you before last, during the big things
brought to my attention, things were revealed really important
things. Yeah. Understand her more as a woman, not as my mom. Yeah.
But as a woman.
Sophie Shiloh
Right, that distinction is everything, I think,
Omisade
is the complexity of who we are as people. And when we get
relegated to a one dimensional or two dimensional identity of just
like, oh, well, they're a mother or their partner or their XYZ,
like your your, we engage in a ratio all the time. Oh, yeah. All
the ways that wait, the people show up. And so I would want to time
travel back to myself and be like, you're getting ready to find out
some things that are gonna help you understand yourself better. All
of who you are, what makes you tick, what you need, what you
deserve, what you actually want, and give yourself permission to
say out loud what you want. Without hesitation. Right. And so, I do
think that it is an ongoing journey of returning to yourself. I
used to be in this place where I felt like if I was evolving as a
person, I was leaving parts of myself behind, which also in you
know, if I'm being honest, I was like banishing parts of myself.
Yeah. It's like, oh, I'm evolving. And so it was like hateful. Oh,
it was just like, Oh, she was so problematic. 16 Ooh, she was so
messy of 25, blue sheep, or whatever, at 30. As opposed to being
like, Oh, I kind of understand why the 16 year old did this, or why
the 25 year old this or why the 30? Or the 35? Did this. All of the
avatars, all of the versions of myself were invested in keeping me
safe? Yeah. And some of the ways that I tried to keep myself safe.
Were like, ill informed. Yeah, or immature. Right. And so
Sophie Shiloh
they were the highest capacity that you had at that time, at that
time.
Omisade
And so what I get to do is engage in reunification of all my
avatars. Listen, I love the 16 year old. I love the 25 year old. I
love the 30 to 35 to 40 to 50 year old, I love all the versions of
myself, and I have like, invited all of myself to be the CO
conspirators of me being happy and safe and unhealthy and whole.
And when I get peaked, or trauma response shows up and that 15 year
old Omisade shows up and she's like, bout it bout it. I'm like,
listen, you're actually safe. It's not a real thing. Is not 1982
You don't have a right. You can you can just show this. Okay?
That's that was 40 years ago, I get why you were doing that. You
don't have to do that. Yeah, what's wrong? Let's talk about it.
Let's drink the water. Just walk outside. And then I'm not and I'm
not mad at you. And I'm not putting you out. And I'm not pushing
you away. I'm actually inviting you in. And then the 15 year old
gets to relax. And be like, Oh, this is cool. Okay, you know,
you're not bad for almost 35 year
Sophie Shiloh
old version. Yeah, she learns that you're not going to punish her
not gonna punish
Omisade
her. I used to punish her. You have to apologize to her because I
was punishing all these younger versions
Sophie Shiloh
of mine and abandoning them and yeah, yeah. Yeah. Okay, so you
brought up two really important things. This for unification. I
want to ask you about what or whom you've had to walk away from in
order to choose you in order to walk towards you, you know, what
you've had to walk away from in order to walk closer to yourself.
And also you mentioned stating what it is that you want when you
when you finally admit to yourself and say out loud in no uncertain
terms what you want. There's obvious power in that and I want you
to talk about that. And you know, because we don't so often or we
don't for years, or we do it very indirectly in a very apologetic
way. So yeah, I mean, take all of that and run with it.
Omisade
Right? You know, the thing that I, I definitely feel like the thing
that I had to walk away from it wasn't a person, it was a belief or
a mindset. And the mindset that I had to walk away from that I'm
still walking away from is that I don't inherently deserve love or
care unless I am performing. Unless I'm sparkly, unless I'm
producing something that's so amazing that you can't find someplace
else. And so this like anxiousness that gets attached to the
performing the anxiousness that gets attached to producing that
anxiousness that gets attached to, I got to do it better than
anybody else has ever done, I got to do something that's like
spectacular, because if I don't, at some point, so whoever I'm
engaged with, whether it's a co worker, whether his collaborator,
whether it's a lover, a partner, or an ex spouse will look at me
and be like, you know, you're not that great. You know, I changed
my mind. I don't mind appealing. I actually don't love you. I don't
think you deserve my love. I don't want to keep you safe. Right? So
this this mindset was like, Oh, shit, well, let me just keep doing
this, you know, Glamour you to glamour myself to glamour, these
folks. So that way, they're always like, wow, there's just a whole
lot of activity going on here. Oh, my goodness. Oh, let me shut is
just so fantastic. And she's so bright, and she's so sparkly. She's
got this big personality, and she does things big. And so Oh, cool.
Oh, my goodness. It's just like, overwhelmed with all the
stimulation that I'm providing right on the stimulation, new sexual
stimulation as well. Like,
Sophie Shiloh
oh, yeah, all kinds of stimulation. Yeah. Oh, she's right. She got
it all.
Omisade
I'm trying to keep you distracted. So you don't see me?
Sophie Shiloh
Yeah. Yeah.
Omisade
Really see me? Full Face. No makeup. No judging. No mask? Yeah, no
dancing. No sexy. No
Sophie Shiloh
performance, no performance. No amazing
Omisade
speaking, or training or facilitation or whatever that I'm engaging
in. And you just looking at me? Straight on, that you won't find me
wanting that you won't look at me and say, Oh, I don't know if I'm
bad. Nevermind, change my mind. Onto the next thing. Good luck.
Right. And so that had to be the thing that I was willing to walk
away from. And also the thing that I needed to be willing to turn
to which was my more authentic self, right? To know that it is okay
for me to remove the mask. You know, there's some masks I'm gonna
hold on to because I'm a black woman live in this country? Yes,
yes. Yes. Look like me here. So there's a max that I do keep that I
will always keep? Yeah. You know, I would I wish I could say that
in my lifetime that that mass Osco also could be discarded that I
could be like, Oh, I can move in this, this world in this country
and feel safe as a black woman. But I don't know if that's actually
going to be a true statement for
Sophie Shiloh
me. Yeah. I mean, we're not going to be alive. Long enough for No,
that's Yeah.
Omisade
Right. So there are some that are very functional. Yeah, I
understand. But there are also some masks that were just really
choking the air out of my body. Yeah. Was not allowing me to see
myself fully and also the folk that I would actually like to see me
fully. You know, once you want, yeah. I get to choose who my
enemies are. Yeah, I can choose who I want to expose, reveal. Lean
into with my vulnerable, authentic, soft open heart itself. Right.
And so the decision to know that oh, you know, that I am sparkly, I
think naturally. And then that's an
Sophie Shiloh
obvious like emanates, you know,
Omisade
I appreciate that. And I also am I have a very strong performative
mask, and so like to be able to really level down into a more
authentic place has been such a beautiful, hard, generous journey
for myself. I feel like I'm extending myself a lot of generosity in
this space, a lot of grace.
Sophie Shiloh
A lot of respect, you have to be courageous,
Omisade
like Yeah, like very scary thing to be like, Oh, here you go, this
is just look, this is me, here I am, when I'm going to write this
thing, oh, when I'm feeling really good about myself, and also when
I've messed up, like, you know, to be able to be like, that was not
okay, I need to fix this, I need that I need to apologize, I need
to take responsibility be culpable for situation,
Sophie Shiloh
or now that you know how to treat yourself without shame. And you
don't approach your own self with derision and hatred anymore. You
can take accountability and take responsibility and apologize in
like a restorative way, in a collaborative way, you know, it
doesn't feel horrible or like an indictment of who you are.
Omisade
It doesn't feel like an indictment. But it can still feel hard. I
had a recent situation where somebody shared with me some really
important things that they experienced with me that was hurtful to
them. It was hurtful. And I'm grateful that they were honest with
me. I'm grateful that they were vulnerable with me. And I felt it
in my chest. I felt sick. I was like, Oh, I cannot believe that I
did that. Right. And my initial reaction was to be defensive. And
to be like, well, that's not what I meant to do, or that's not
that's not that's not what I really feel like. But that's not
useful. And it doesn't actually matter. Yeah. So it doesn't
matter.
Sophie Shiloh
It doesn't matter.
Omisade
So like me centering my feelings, exactly. Who was courageous
enough to say to me, Oh, me, there's something that you do that's
hurtful to me
Sophie Shiloh
doing it? And what a friend. That's powerful.
Omisade
Right, which lets me know that this person actually loves me. Yes.
Right. Like they have our relationship and they want our
relationship to be stronger, more
Sophie Shiloh
unlike guess what, oh, me, I love you. And I love our relationship,
even when you do something that hurt me, like,
Omisade
invite you to stop doing it. And I want to talk with you about it.
So the first thing I did was, you know, give myself permission to
feel my feelings. You know, like, I kind of walked around, you
know, I needed to get myself together. And then I responded and was
like, Thank you. Yep. And I'm sorry. And I take responsibility. And
I'm committed to fixing this. And we can talk about this when
you're ready. I got there's work I gotta do.
Sophie Shiloh
Yeah. And that's so simple.
Omisade
It's so simple. I was all the rage of emotions. I felt like crying.
My heart was just racing, shaking. And, you know, I also was trying
to be very, very vigilant in my response. I was like, I want them
to know that this is not a knee jerk reaction. Take your time. Take
your time. Take your time. This is important. Like, again, there is
no perfection, we will hurt people. Yeah. We will mess up. People
will hurt us. They will mess up. And like they this person model
for me how I can also let people know when I feel harmed by
someone's actions or words to say, Listen, I really care about you.
And I care about this relationship. There's some things that you've
done that really hurt me. Yeah. And I'd like for us to talk
about
Sophie Shiloh
I think that having those kinds of conversations, in friendships
and relationships and in, in professional relationships with
colleagues is becoming more normalized and more accepted. And I
think that's so exciting because you can have, we don't have to
have relationships anymore that feel like putting on a mask for 30
years.
Omisade
Right? Right. Or waiting for you know, part of my my shadow side of
my fire is I would allow myself to get angry. And then my main
three will be the fuel for my honesty.
Sophie Shiloh
Yes. Yeah. I mean, as an Aries. Literally you're just speaking my
soul. Yes,
Omisade
I know lighter as all the way up. Like I was like, wait until I am
like looking like Jack Jack from the incredible. Yeah. And then I'm
gonna let you have it. Yeah. And I was I'm gonna be honest, like
brutally honest and say, everything that I've been holding on to,
as opposed to like giving myself permission all along. To be like,
that was not okay. I'll feel good about that. You know,
Sophie Shiloh
when I was always open, and
Omisade
anger and rage is a real emotion that I also don't want to deny
myself or act like I'm not exclusionary. Yeah. And also that that
gives me more information again, about where I'm at what's going on
with me. I'm experiencing your rage, which I think is scary to not
scary about It's been problematized like, yeah,
Sophie Shiloh
if you are, it's been pathologized. And yes, of course, Italy has
Sophie. So like, if you are, I cannot even Yeah, it's it's horrific
like for, for me to talk about, like how I'm like healing my
relationship with anger. It's one thing but I'm like, I cannot even
understand a black woman or healing her relationship with anger,
like, when you've been told by everyone in in all areas, you're not
allowed to have this. If you do, it will be like we said,
pathologized and you'll be legalized. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah.
Omisade
The indictment is really intense. And the punishment is really
intense is just like, what,
Sophie Shiloh
if you're going to actually punished for having emotion
Omisade
actually be punished for having emotions that happen
generationally?
Sophie Shiloh
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that is a lot to overcome. So you know what,
let's, I know, we're like at the end of the hour. Um, and as far as
I know, you're not free for the rest for the next eight hours of
the day to keep.
Omisade
I'm, like, be like, let's go get some tea, and come back and
continue this conversation. And don't be like, get some wine and
continue this conversation.
Sophie Shiloh
Let's just keep going and going, seriously, I love talking to you.
Um, but I do want to, like in the in this next transition to the
end of the conversation, where I want you to tell everyone how they
can find everything from you, and learn from you and all of the
things that you have to offer. But also just, this is gonna be
where we started the conversation, but it wasn't in discussing
decolonizing, menopause, and decolonizing, healing and decolonizing
what it means to just be a person in the world. What, tell us tell
us a little bit about what how you'd like to end this conversation
on that note.
Omisade
Mm hmm. I think that, you know, a lot of people have been using the
moniker of decolonization as it relates to a lot of constructs that
we move inside of, in our culture, right. So people talk about
decolonizing fitness, they talk about decolonizing aging. But the
decolonizing construct was first introduced to me by my indigenous
brothers and sisters who talked about the decolonization of an of
an indigenous mine and an indigenous land indigenous bodies, right?
It's like, what does it mean for someone who is not a part of your
culture, who did not originate from the land, the space, the region
are, who you are, to come in, Co Op, and take your land, and then
also engage in the erasure and the genocide of your, of your
people? Like intentionally, right? So the decolonization
systematically
Sophie Shiloh
intentionally for centuries? Yeah.
Omisade
So the decolonization language was first introduced to me through
indigeneity. It's like, what does it mean for indigenous First
Nation people to be engaged in the decolonization not only of the
land, but of their culture and their people, right. And that
requires deep study in history. It requires a deep understanding of
constructs and systemic oppression. It requires a commitment to
this radical liberatory healing and love and what is possible in
terms of reunification and really understanding who you are. And so
when I talk about decolonizing, menopause, I really begin by
thinking about what has been the journey of women, women identify
people or gender expansive people's bodies, in our culture, and how
our bodies have been problematized? In particular, black bodies,
right. So what's been our experience with not having agency over
our bodies? What's been our experience of not being believed about
how we're experiencing our bodies, whether that is pain, right,
where the best is comfort with an S concern or fear, and being
told, well, that couldn't possibly be true. That's not you can't be
experiencing that amount of pain. You're Yeah. You're fine. And the
implications can range from like, just real confusion and
discomfort to death. Yes, of course. Yeah. No, the outcome can be
death. Yeah. And so if we are decolonizing, menopause and aging, it
kind of lives inside of this rubric of like, what does it mean for
you to have agency over your body? And what were you told about
your body? Who told you that? Where did the message Yeah, about
your body? What your body can do as your body continues to evolve.
Your body is always changing and evolving. From the moment you take
your first breath to the moment you take your life. And in between
all of those moments, we have been told as black people as black
women, that your body is a problem. Your body is a problem the way
is shaped, your size, your sex, your sexuality,
Sophie Shiloh
your, your hair, every everything,
Omisade
everything is a problem. And so that you find yourself in at this
stage of your life where you're aging, your body shifting and
changing again. And then people are telling you what menopause is
the whole shit show.
Sophie Shiloh
You're going to be hot problems get different and worse.
Omisade
It's going to awful awful in your your vagina is going to dry up
and then you're going to die.
Sophie Shiloh
Yeah, that's it. No one's gonna ever love you again. And
Omisade
absolutely not. You were not lovable. You weren't lovable to begin
with. But now you're
Sophie Shiloh
now you're extra disgusting. Yeah. Right.
Omisade
And so the decolonising have added the deconstructing of that and
pulling the pulling apart and looking in. I'm always I'm always a
student of history. I love I love history, I'm a student of
culture, I pay attention to the way culture moves, and the way we
treat each other and what we value what we don't value. And then so
the framing of decolonizing, menopause, decolonizing aging
decolonizing. The Crone is to deconstruct through my understanding
of history, and contemporary constructs, what we believe about our
bodies and our value and our ability to have agency our ability to
choose our ability to evolve, and love and heal and be safe, and
experience, pleasure and joy, all those things.
Sophie Shiloh
So let's end with talking about the word beautiful, because when I
hear you speak, and when I read your words, and when I look at you,
that word just flashes in front of me, I mean, so unbelievably,
unspeakably beautiful. But you mentioned in your style, like you
interview which everyone should go listen to that that's not a word
you use to describe yourself. So and I'm also obsessed with, with
women and, and female bodied people finding value in finding
identity and things that have nothing to do with physical beauty.
You know, for so many reasons, we could talk about that
consumption, etc. But how do you describe yourself? What are the
words that you love to use to describe? Only Shodai?
Omisade
I do think I have a beautiful heart. I think I have I call myself
lionhearted. Because I think I'm very courageous. I think I'm very
generous. And I think I'm very protective of the people that I
love. So that's definitely one of the first things that I would
describe myself as. I also think I'm funny as hell, like, I think
I'm a hoot. And I have a quick, quick body sense of humor. So I
enjoy that I enjoy the quips that I can pull out to bring levity to
the situation or just just enjoy and be raucous. Yeah, I have a
rock if the sense of humor, I think I'm also very sensual person.
Enjoy touch. I enjoy being touched, and I enjoy touching people. I
like the sensory experience of pleasure. So smell and touch and
music. So I think that I'm not always I don't always say it in that
way. But I do think I'm a very sensual person. You know, as far as
my aesthetic is concerned, I still wouldn't say that I'm beautiful
in terms of what people would see physically. I think I'm striking.
I think that I sassy, sexy, even, um, but not Not, not beautiful. I
think there's someone will look at me like, Oh, she's striking, but
not like, Oh, she's really beautiful. You know, I don't know why
that still feels that way. I'm still committed to exploring that
and being open to seeing myself beautiful inside and out. Yeah. I
think that I am a very emotive, emotionally sensitive person. So,
you know, a lot of people these days are using the language of
Empath, or empathic, or empathetic. I think I have a certain
sensitivity to energy. And so when I see someone struggling, I want
to understand what's going on. I want to be helpful. If I see
somebody happy or excited, I want to be excited to be like, This is
so good. We should talk about this. I want to celebrate, like I'm
definitely like, we should share that. Yeah. Yeah, I definitely my
mood can be affected by the people who I really care about in
their, in their, their joy and in their sorrow. I have a particular
sensitivity in that way and I'm a lucid dreamer. So I Eve in the
spirit realm. I'm very spiritual. I have a deep spiritual practice.
And I know that I sometimes receive messages through my sleep, that
I know our dreams. And I'm a lucid enough dreamer that sometimes
I'll even talk to myself in a dream and say you should pay
attention to this part of
Sophie Shiloh
this. Yeah. Well, that's helpful. That's convenient that you have
that. It is helpful it like pay attention.
Omisade
But sometimes it doesn't lend itself to actually restorative deep
sleep because I'm just busy all night long.
Sophie Shiloh
All night long. Yeah. Is with myself. Yeah, that is true, then
you'll wake up and you're like, I just I was at work all night.
Right. And I was getting shit done.
Omisade
getting stuff done. And I need to think about what I was getting
done. And I need to figure out what this means.
Sophie Shiloh
Right? Yeah. Seriously? Oh, that is so funny. Yeah. Completely. Oh,
my goodness. Well, I cannot thank you enough. I think that this was
a really important conversation that I wanted to have. And I really
wanted you on my podcast because when I think about it, I I have to
be obsessed with what is going to help my clients stop wasting
their 20s on people pleasing and start being alive and start loving
their lives free from codependency free from all the codependent
bullshit, not having boundaries, feeling insecure, not living life
as fully as it wants us to live it. And so you were the perfect
person I was like she has to come on my any of the millennial women
who are struggling with codependency needs to hear about how
Omisade is done fucking around, not living a beautiful life that
you savor all the time. And I again, I cannot thank you enough for
your example, in that. And for all the guidance you've given us.
Everyone has to go listen to your podcast. It's genius. And I want
you to tell us where we can learn from you. Tell everyone your
offerings now please do that.
Omisade
I appreciate Sophie so much being able to have this conversation I
absolutely enjoy the relationships I have with the millennial women
and women identify people in my life. I learned so much from them.
Yeah, well, you can check us out on our website is WWE dot Black
Girls Guide to surviving menopause, you can listen to the first
three seasons of the podcast wherever you listen to your podcast,
whether that's on Apple, or Stitcher or Spotify or wherever we are
about to launch season four in March. So we're really excited about
that. And we just had our first interview episode interview for
season four is going to be so juicy overview I
Sophie Shiloh
cannot wait.
Omisade
Oh good. Um, yeah, and you can follow us on social media. You can
follow me at Oshunsweetnsour that's Oshunsweetnsour or you can
follow Black Girls Guide at Black Girls Guide to menopause on IG So
yeah, that's where you can check me out.
Sophie Shiloh
And regardless of your racial identity or your age, I want every
you know tiny little like Chinese 16 year old high school student
to listen to Black Girls Guide to surviving then it's like your
everybody is welcome. Everyone who has a child, anyone who has a
daughter like everyone has to listen to it. It's genius. Oh me
thank you so much for today. I hope you have a beautiful day and
I'll talk to you soon.
Omisade
Absolutely Beloved. Thanks so much.
Sophie Shiloh
Bye gorgeous. Thank you so much for listening. If you love this
episode, which I don't know how you couldn't go find everything
Omisade related in the show notes. Go follow her on Instagram at
Oshunsweetnsour. Go listen to her genius podcast Black Girls Guide
to surviving menopause and you can also find all of her work and
how to hire her and connect with her at Black Girls Guide to
surviving menopause.com To learn more about me and the work that I
do with my clients to heal their codependency and to apply for one
of the last few spots in my next group coaching round. Find me on
Instagram at codependent millennial, or visit my website at
codependent millennial.com. You can also text me at 216279 4035 And
yes, it's really me, I promise. Until next time, have a really,
really lovely time being alive and I'll talk to you very soon.
Bye
Transcribed by https://otter.ai